Hi guest. Welcome to FreakingNews! Register (free) or Login     
    Live Help  
FreakingNews homepage
Forums | FN T-Shirts | Chat Room | Site News | Member Search | Hall of Fame | 

All Forums
News Contests Discussions

Scoring/Confusion


Register or Login
to Post in This Thread.


Page 1 2 3 4
kennyb
3/15/2012 1:52:01 PM


Status: Wal Mart Greeter
Scoring/Confusion

OK...I am not upset or trying to rant...I am confused.

If this (below) is the voting scale than how does this image make it over a five...don't get me wrong I love the concept but according to the voting scale it probably needed another 15 minutes worth of work (which is actually a "3"). I would give it higher than a three but not sure about a 7, 8 or 9...because of the obvious backgroound blending issue. Can someone explain the disconnect?



In case the image doesn't load

1. Any entry that is horrible. It should also be flagged.

EXAMPLE: Photoshop - Brutal blending and jagged layer edges.


2. An entry that is below average. Definitely needs that extra hour of work or thought. Easy things have been ignored.

3. An entry that could have been good, but is missing that extra 15 minutes of work or thought behind it.

4. It's average. Not great, not bad.

5. It's better than average.

6. It's much better than average. Great idea and execution.

7. Terrific idea and terrific execution makes this entry more than "just being great".

8. This is almost perfect and looks like professionally done image you'd see in magazines and media.

9. This is professionally done and is PERFECT in every possible way. There is not a single flaw in the image and the idea behind it is brilliant. This is one of the most amazing entries I have ever seen on the site.



[Edited by 'kennyb' on 3/15/2012 2:08:10 PM]
Comments: 74
Contest Entries: 11
NewsMaster
Independents
3/15/2012 2:53:09 PM


Status: Commander in Chief
One of the greatest artists of all time, Leonardo, said "True art is never finished, only abandoned". So, any entry can have another 15, 30, or more minutes of work, and it does not make it worthy of a vote of 3.

What we meant in the voting scale guidelines is that the entry that gets a 3 is the entry that *could* have been good if extra 15 minutes of work were spent on it.

There could be entries that are worthy of 7 or 8, and some extra work would make them worthy of a higher vote.

by the way, it's a good courtesy not to discuss the scores/votes of entries that are in an active contest. AFTER a contest ends, it's fine though.
Comments: 99153
Contest Entries: 14
Out of my mind. Back in five minutes.

kennyb
Independents
3/15/2012 7:04:23 PM


Status: Wal Mart Greeter
I figured the competition was basically over. Sorry...I know it wasn't officially over.
Comments: 74
Contest Entries: 11

kennyb
Independents
3/15/2012 7:04:23 PM


Status: Wal Mart Greeter
I figured the competition was basically over. Sorry...I know it wasn't officially over.
Comments: 74
Contest Entries: 11

Wiz
Independents
3/15/2012 7:13:08 PM


Status: Commander in Chief

On 3/15/2012 1:52:01 PM, kennyb said:
OK...I am not upset or trying to rant...I am confused.

If this (below) is the voting scale than how does this image make it over a five...don't get me wrong I love the concept but according to the voting scale it probably needed another 15 minutes worth of work (which is actually a "3"). I would give it higher than a three but not sure about a 7, 8 or 9...because of the obvious backgroound blending issue. Can someone explain the disconnect?



In case the image doesn't load

1. Any entry that is horrible. It should also be flagged.

EXAMPLE: Photoshop - Brutal blending and jagged layer edges.


2. An entry that is below average. Definitely needs that extra hour of work or thought. Easy things have been ignored.

3. An entry that could have been good, but is missing that extra 15 minutes of work or thought behind it.

4. It's average. Not great, not bad.

5. It's better than average.

6. It's much better than average. Great idea and execution.

7. Terrific idea and terrific execution makes this entry more than "just being great".

8. This is almost perfect and looks like professionally done image you'd see in magazines and media.

9. This is professionally done and is PERFECT in every possible way. There is not a single flaw in the image and the idea behind it is brilliant. This is one of the most amazing entries I have ever seen on the site.



[Edited by 'kennyb' on 3/15/2012 2:08:10 PM]



"Ah kenny, I see you were one of the twenty one that gave me a five vote, thanks for voting anyways! After all winners are grinners!"



Wiz

Comments: 221
Contest Entries: 430

AzureSky
Independents
3/15/2012 8:37:09 PM


Status: Commander in Chief

On 3/15/2012 7:13:08 PM, Wiz said:

On 3/15/2012 1:52:01 PM, kennyb said:
OK...I am not upset or trying to rant...I am confused.

If this (below) is the voting scale than how does this image make it over a five...don't get me wrong I love the concept but according to the voting scale it probably needed another 15 minutes worth of work (which is actually a "3"). I would give it higher than a three but not sure about a 7, 8 or 9...because of the obvious backgroound blending issue. Can someone explain the disconnect?


I didn't vote Wix, but I was as confused by the background as everyone else. I loved the space ship clock.
In case the image doesn't load

1. Any entry that is horrible. It should also be flagged.

EXAMPLE: Photoshop - Brutal blending and jagged layer edges.


2. An entry that is below average. Definitely needs that extra hour of work or thought. Easy things have been ignored.

3. An entry that could have been good, but is missing that extra 15 minutes of work or thought behind it.

4. It's average. Not great, not bad.

5. It's better than average.

6. It's much better than average. Great idea and execution.

7. Terrific idea and terrific execution makes this entry more than "just being great".

8. This is almost perfect and looks like professionally done image you'd see in magazines and media.

9. This is professionally done and is PERFECT in every possible way. There is not a single flaw in the image and the idea behind it is brilliant. This is one of the most amazing entries I have ever seen on the site.



[Edited by 'kennyb' on 3/15/2012 2:08:10 PM]



"Ah kenny, I see you were one of the twenty one that gave me a five vote, thanks for voting anyways! After all winners are grinners!"



Wiz




Comments: 12495
Contest Entries: 1352
Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself, but talent instantly recognizes genius. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

Kellie
Independents
3/15/2012 8:42:44 PM
Status: Commander in Chief
I agree whole-heartedly re not discussing/exampling people chops, even after contest, not nice to be "put out there".

...but I do agree with you re the masking issues...but end of day/vote it's the voters that choose the winner, not us as individuals...art is like people, we all view them different.

Glad ya a grinnin Wiz LoL

Ps: Also the voting scale really needs 2b updated, the quality of art has improved so quick & we the need the scale to reflect it, I would never give a 3 nowadays and it has to be pretty rough for me to dish out even a 4...

Us admins need to get our a$$e$ in2 gear & get this done, especially for the newcomers who do use it & like yourself.
Comments: 16532
Contest Entries: 291

kennyb
Independents
3/15/2012 9:25:44 PM


Status: Wal Mart Greeter
There are no sour grapes here...I'd like to know how anyone would know how I voted...I don't even remember what I voted. Besides the point. It the scale it what the scale is than we should stick to it, that is all I am saying...I do this for fun more than anything...not like there is some big prize for winning.

Regarding the spending an extra 15 minutes, hour or whatever the length of time...there is a difference in trying for perfection and an outright bad mask/retouch job...which is clearly spelled out in the rules. Now if the powers that be decide to change the rules...then OK...I am new to this community and while I see some brilliant work and some great concepts...a concept is only as great as it execution. I really don't care that I didn't get first place or not this is about the rules as they were given and how they are applied. I simply asked a question since there didn't seem to be any place else to air my question.

Like it or not Wiz, your concept was great but your execution was lacking...1st place or not.
Comments: 74
Contest Entries: 11

Wiz
Independents
3/15/2012 10:52:40 PM


Status: Commander in Chief

On 3/15/2012 9:25:44 PM, kennyb said:
There are no sour grapes here...I'd like to know how anyone would know how I voted...I don't even remember what I voted. Besides the point. It the scale it what the scale is than we should stick to it, that is all I am saying...I do this for fun more than anything...not like there is some big prize for winning.

Regarding the spending an extra 15 minutes, hour or whatever the length of time...there is a difference in trying for perfection and an outright bad mask/retouch job...which is clearly spelled out in the rules. Now if the powers that be decide to change the rules...then OK...I am new to this community and while I see some brilliant work and some great concepts...a concept is only as great as it execution. I really don't care that I didn't get first place or not this is about the rules as they were given and how they are applied. I simply asked a question since there didn't seem to be any place else to air my question.

Like it or not Wiz, your concept was great but your execution was lacking...1st place or not.



You told me yourself kenny, I quote "I would give it more than a 3... but under a 7". Kinda boxed you in with what I see on 'Who Voted' panel next to my image. Looking forward to seeing what you do for your next (8th) contest entry! Have fun.

Wiz
Comments: 221
Contest Entries: 430

kennyb
Independents
3/15/2012 11:21:34 PM


Status: Wal Mart Greeter
Doesn't mean I gave you a five...could have been a six...I am not even sure...again...unimportant since intentionally voting someone down or up effects your Karma on this site...I vote my heart and conscience and based on the rules of this site...nothing else. 8th entry or not I am very secure in what I know and what I do and can do...I don't need to win or win first place to validate that I have enough "real trophies" that none of that matters and honestly never did.

I don't see any point in continuing to talk about this...it is becoming obvious that this isn't an open forum for discussion. Apparently questions regarding the contests and the scoring of entries is off limited...maybe that should be spelled out in the rules too.

[Edited by User on 3/15/2012 11:20:29 PM]
Comments: 74
Contest Entries: 11

NewsMaster
Independents
3/15/2012 11:47:29 PM


Status: Commander in Chief
Kennyb: This is an open forum about contests.

Individual votes on entries are obviously a sensitive issue, that's why it's anonymous.

Doesn't mean it's off limits for discussion though. Sometimes we get emails from members who ask why they got lower scores than they deserved. In such cases we advise them to start a forum thread about their chop in question, so other members can tell them why the entry got the score it got and what could be done to improve the score. It's all fine and transparent when the thread is about member's own entry, but it gets a bit touchy when the thread is about someone else's entry.

Nonetheless, Wiz, you did have that masking issue, mate, though it was a great chop otherwise.
Comments: 99153
Contest Entries: 14
Out of my mind. Back in five minutes.

kennyb
Independents
3/16/2012 1:38:53 AM


Status: Wal Mart Greeter
NewsMaster, It is not obvious on this site who are the Moderators and who are just members and who you should direct private e-mails and questions toward. Unless I wanted to report/register a complaint about an entry, in which case it is clear. This to me did not warrant an actual complaint/report it warranted a discussion.

I see your point regarding picking someone else's work, but that is actually the reason I wrote this when I did...we were all anonymous at the time. The only reason I brought up the score conversation was based on the "rules" regarding "scoring" and my being new to this whole, "Karma", its effect on voting as well as the interpretation of what the rules were saying, which seemed at odds with the results.

At no point have I said my work is superior or that anyone else's work was crap...quite the contrary, I have praised Wiz's work both in the comments (of his piece) and in this forum for his creativity and the idea behind his work and have been constructive about my criticism regarding it being a bad fade/blend or mask...that if corrected (easily corrected, I fixed it in a couple of minutes after downloading the JPG) this piece would most definitely deserve the number one place it got.
Comments: 74
Contest Entries: 11

Laredog
Independents
3/16/2012 4:17:31 AM


Status: Speech Writer
My two cents, probably don't matter, but since I care here goes.
It is known the moderators vote (that is clear under "who voted"). It is also clear (from an email I received) that moderators all know who submits what. There is no "hidden" to them.
I don't see where people say they know how someone voted. maybe someone could explain that to me. (I do not see that Newsmaster or whomever voted an 8 on my work, just that it had this many 8s).
I agree the scoring should be uniform and would only hope it is fair, although I see great potential for favoritism and bias here.
I agree also that the leaders here, because there are so many new people, should change things up a little (which apparently doesn't happen much) and make some cool changes.... like bracketing skill levels and having different contests for different levels (Pros should have own bracket and contests). 2. Some kind of award for best "concept" would be nice. Some of us have awesome ideas, but not the skills to perfect the art.
I've only been here one month but I'm already disappointed that a couple things I've done looked better than others, but scored much worse.
Maybe I just don't get this whole thing either. I almost quit several times, but friends have urged me to stay in.
Lare
Comments: 239
Contest Entries: 111
Laredog "Gone Fishing"

FloridaGator
Republicans
3/16/2012 11:10:30 AM
Status: Wal Mart Greeter
I am SOOOOOO glad I skipped on voting in this contest! I agree (not that my opinion matters) that the descriptions on the voting scale need to be edited. From what I saw in the winning entry of the contest there was a GLARING mistake. According the the current voting scale, a 1 has brutal blending and jagged layer edges. which this entry has. The entry could easily be seen as a 2 because Easy things have been ignored. Again, according to the voting scale this entry could've been given a 3 as it is missing that extra 15 minutes of work or thought behind it. The right hand side of the image, in my opinion and in accordance to the voting scale, deserves a 7 or 8 according to the voting scale. If I had voted, I probably would've voted a winning entry a 4, which in my opinion is gracious. I completely agree with kennyb that the concept is brilliant and the majority of the image is very well chopped but if I were to follow the voting scale my Karma would've taken a HUGE hit (if I had any Karma points).

Like kennyb and Laredog I am new here and don't want to rock the boat. But I would love to figure out this karma thing because I'd like to have some influence on the outcome of contests. I thought I was doing the right thing by following the voting scale and voting honestly. I have only voted on a few contests and have voted honestly each time. I have even studied (way too many) past winning and top four entries to see how other members voting habits are on images. I did get my karma up to 50 or 60 but then apparently did something wrong in two straight contests I voted in and got swatted back down to 1 karma point. It has honestly made me scared/indifferent to voting. I figure it is utterly pointless as my vote won't count anyways. So I guess I have two points. One is backing up the other comments in this thread about changing the voting scale. The other is about karma.

I know karma points are awarded or taken away based on the differences in my votes compared to the average score of an entry. I have read somewhere that karma is more greatly effected when an entry places top 4. Is there a formula that is used when awarding karma? If there is, I feel it would only be fair to share the formula so we know what we are being judged on when voting. Is Karma loss/gain determined by a computer program? Do admin regulate karma gain/loss? I understand if this information needs to be kept from public knowledge but figure it doesn't hurt to ask. I just want to be able to figure out what I am doing wrong as I thought I had been voting fairly.

That's all.....my rant is finished.
Comments: 57
Contest Entries: 10

Laredog
Independents
3/16/2012 11:47:16 AM


Status: Speech Writer

On 3/16/2012 11:10:30 AM, FloridaGator said:
I am SOOOOOO glad I skipped on voting in this contest! I agree (not that my opinion matters) that the descriptions on the voting scale need to be edited. From what I saw in the winning entry of the contest there was a GLARING mistake. According the the current voting scale, a 1 has brutal blending and jagged layer edges. which this entry has. The entry could easily be seen as a 2 because Easy things have been ignored. Again, according to the voting scale this entry could've been given a 3 as it is missing that extra 15 minutes of work or thought behind it. The right hand side of the image, in my opinion and in accordance to the voting scale, deserves a 7 or 8 according to the voting scale. If I had voted, I probably would've voted a winning entry a 4, which in my opinion is gracious. I completely agree with kennyb that the concept is brilliant and the majority of the image is very well chopped but if I were to follow the voting scale my Karma would've taken a HUGE hit (if I had any Karma points).

Like kennyb and Laredog I am new here and don't want to rock the boat. But I would love to figure out this karma thing because I'd like to have some influence on the outcome of contests. I thought I was doing the right thing by following the voting scale and voting honestly. I have only voted on a few contests and have voted honestly each time. I have even studied (way too many) past winning and top four entries to see how other members voting habits are on images. I did get my karma up to 50 or 60 but then apparently did something wrong in two straight contests I voted in and got swatted back down to 1 karma point. It has honestly made me scared/indifferent to voting. I figure it is utterly pointless as my vote won't count anyways. So I guess I have two points. One is backing up the other comments in this thread about changing the voting scale. The other is about karma.

I know karma points are awarded or taken away based on the differences in my votes compared to the average score of an entry. I have read somewhere that karma is more greatly effected when an entry places top 4. Is there a formula that is used when awarding karma? If there is, I feel it would only be fair to share the formula so we know what we are being judged on when voting. Is Karma loss/gain determined by a computer program? Do admin regulate karma gain/loss? I understand if this information needs to be kept from public knowledge but figure it doesn't hurt to ask. I just want to be able to figure out what I am doing wrong as I thought I had been voting fairly.

That's all.....my rant is finished.



Seems there is a fairly simple answer here... The most sucessful choppers should have the highest Karma. Not because they vote best, but because they KNOW best. (And I realize Karma is to keep those voters honest!) That's where management comes in and warns against poor voting habits. But I also agree if us noobs vote, we would like to think it matters...

Still waiting on answer on how people know what number somebody else placed on their work. I've heard this now several times, and don't see where they find that out.
Comments: 239
Contest Entries: 111
Laredog "Gone Fishing"

AzureSky
Independents
3/16/2012 12:15:05 PM


Status: Commander in Chief

Wiz




Dear Wiz, I am sorry I didn't vote, your image was great. If I had voted I would still have given it 8 despite the masking issue. If the masking had been fixed I would have given it 9 or 10. The space ship and idea were absolutely great. I assume the blue part meant no time, the part where space showed real time.

To those who feel their scores were not good enough I recommend they study their images very closely. I have been disappointed not to make top 5 a few times but having studied the ones in front, I can see they were better.


As Kellie rightly said, the standard here is improving so much, the voting scale definitely needs to be looked at again. Having a separate category for manga and caricatures would be a good idea.

It would be great if there could be some more tutorials on the new software available would be an enormous help to those of us who are struggling to use it.

I definitely think a separate category for manga and caricatures is needed. They do confuse the issue somewhat and nearly always win or score highly.



Comments: 12495
Contest Entries: 1352
Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself, but talent instantly recognizes genius. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

Chili
Independents
3/16/2012 3:31:37 PM


Status: Commander in Chief
Just to put it on the record , I feel that this contest was the worst voting ever in history . Hows that for a Laugh !!!!! Blaaaaaaa . I just love this damn place !!!! Lets just make a FN contest about this . Call it maybe , "Worst Mask"(that is passable for voting) LOL . Good job to everyone who entered that damn contest , you all busted your balls for nothing . Next time try to unmask your mask !!!!! Hugs
Comments: 1696
Contest Entries: 327
Truly great madness can not be achieved without using Photoshop ;-)

AzureSky
Independents
3/16/2012 5:25:05 PM


Status: Commander in Chief

On 3/16/2012 3:31:37 PM, Chili said:
Just to put it on the record , I feel that this contest was the worst voting ever in history . Hows that for a Laugh !!!!! Blaaaaaaa . I just love this damn place !!!! Lets just make a FN contest about this . Call it maybe , "Worst Mask"(that is passable for voting) LOL . Good job to everyone who entered that damn contest , you all busted your balls for nothing . Next time try to unmask your mask !!!!! Hugs



Lol Chili. It might be fun do do some really bad masking but maybe not in an actual contest. We could do it in the forum.
Comments: 12495
Contest Entries: 1352
Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself, but talent instantly recognizes genius. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

preemiememe
Democrats
3/16/2012 6:28:41 PM


Status: Commander in Chief
i dont care if a persons a friend or not,,i vote my way,,, 1st on the piece,,combined with concept,,, if a persons idea is amazing,but they only stick a head on something ,they aren't getting a high mark,,,its a PS contest ,,, skills,,,
Sometimes its easy to guess whos work is whos,, artist develop a style. sometimes
you can be surprised as an artist will mature and gain skills,,thats the fun of the contests.
One thing i learned competition sure brings a persons personality out . How about channeling the frustrations of the contest and use it to fuel your creativity .
I for one know there is amazing artists here.. all able to win a contest,, and just because you dont win dosent mean your not good ,,or theres something fishy going on,,
ive been here a few years now,, look at the amount of trophies i have,,in comparison to the entries.. you cant always win,,, But when you do just enjoy the feeling,, its an honor to win in such artistic company ,,not a right,,,

[Edited by User on 3/16/2012 6:26:43 PM]
Comments: 7611
Contest Entries: 1033
"Sheet or get off the pot"

Disasterman111
Democrats
3/16/2012 7:36:53 PM


Status: Commander in Chief
Its really easy to tell who is voting fairly, just look at their Karma, if you vote fairly your Karma increases & if not it drops!
Comments: 5217
Contest Entries: 109
If it was easy anyone could do it!

AzureSky
Independents
3/16/2012 8:32:04 PM


Status: Commander in Chief

On 3/16/2012 7:36:53 PM, Disasterman111 said:
Its really easy to tell who is voting fairly, just look at their Karma, if you vote fairly your Karma increases & if not it drops!



I don't agree with that because I have lost karma for voting higher. There have been chops I thought were wonderful that tanked, while others that didn't follow guidelines or were just face swaps score highly.

I had good karma before I stopped coming very often, when I got back the standard was so much higher, the old guidelines just didn't apply any more.

This voting lark is becoming more of a guessing game, trying to predict how other people will vote. How many wrong votes (guesses)do you have to lose karma?
Comments: 12495
Contest Entries: 1352
Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself, but talent instantly recognizes genius. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

Page 1 2 3 4

You must log in to comment!

home - register - login - contests - galleries - FAQ - terms of service - tutorials - guidelines - privacy - copyright - contact - ^top

Jim Carrey the Pig Dali Lama as Osama Bin Laden Smiling Cyclops Vladimir Putin in a Trabant The Parrot People Watcher Hugh Grant Facelift

2020, Freaking News. Code by Worth1000. Page generated at 2/28/2020 3:21:14 AM in 0.11 seconds.